Legislature(2013 - 2014)BELTZ 105 (TSBldg)

04/16/2014 09:30 AM Senate JUDICIARY


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* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
-- Recessed to 1:30 pm --
+ HB 127 OMBUDSMAN TELECONFERENCED
Moved SCS CSHB 127(JUD) Out of Committee
+ HB 140 REGULATIONS: NOTICE, REVIEW, COMMENT TELECONFERENCED
Moved SCS CSHB 140(JUD) Out of Committee
+ HB 60 UNIFORM REAL PROPERTY TRANSFERS ON DEATH TELECONFERENCED
Moved CSHB 60(JUD) Out of Committee
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
        HB  60-UNIFORM REAL PROPERTY TRANSFERS ON DEATH                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:44:41 AM                                                                                                                    
CHAIR   COGHILL  reconvened   the  meeting   and  announced   the                                                               
consideration  of HB  60. "An  Act adopting  and relating  to the                                                               
Uniform  Real  Property  Transfer   on  Death  Act;  relating  to                                                               
establishing the  law governing  certain trusts; and  relating to                                                               
disclaimers of property interests. " This was the first hearing.                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:45:54 AM                                                                                                                    
REPRESENTATIVE MAX  GRUENBERG, Alaska State  Legislature, Juneau,                                                               
Alaska, sponsor of HB 60,  said this legislation does two things.                                                               
First, it  has a provision  that models a Delaware  Supreme Court                                                               
case which  said that if a  trust instrument is silent  as to the                                                               
choice of law  and it is administered in Delaware,  the choice of                                                               
law would be  Delaware. The House Judiciary  Committee added this                                                               
provision in Section 1 of the  bill. It helps keep Alaska's trust                                                               
laws as competitive and trust-friendly as possible.                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
The rest  of the  bill adds  a new  chapter to  AS 13  called the                                                               
"Uniform  Real  Property  Transfer  on Death  Act."  This  avoids                                                               
probate  and  legal   fees  for  estates  that   aren't  huge  or                                                               
complicated.  The property  owner  records a  deed  that says  it                                                               
becomes effective  upon their death.  The property owner  has the                                                               
ability to change the deed but it  must be recorded so that it is                                                               
in the  chain of  title and  easily ascertainable.  This protects                                                               
the title and any of the people who may be involved.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  noted that the bill  contains forms for                                                               
the deed and  the revocation of the deed. It  has been thoroughly                                                               
vetted through  the Bar  probate and  real property  sections and                                                               
they suggest  seeking legal advice  if there is any  doubt. About                                                               
23 states have these laws. The  first was passed in the 1980s and                                                               
then the Uniform Commissioners promulgated  this Act about six or                                                               
seven years ago and it is gaining appeal.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:51:31 AM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if there  was a financial limit on the                                                               
size of an estate that can be deeded.                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said no.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked if the property has to be in Alaska.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  said yes and  whether a TOD  deed would                                                               
be  effective  depends  upon  the  law in  the  state  where  the                                                               
property is located.  For example, Missouri has a  similar law so                                                               
a TOD  deed would  apply, whereas  California does  not so  a TOD                                                               
deed would not apply.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL asked how Section 1 applies to the Uniform Act.                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG explained  that that  provision applies                                                               
to states in which trusts  are administered. It clarifies that it                                                               
is  the law  of Alaska  generally that  applies if  the trust  is                                                               
administered here  regardless of  where the property  is located,                                                               
the trust was drafted, and the donors and beneficiaries reside.                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:56:10 AM                                                                                                                    
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked  if this would allow  parties in other                                                               
states to bypass estate taxes.                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG  clarified that it  is not a  tax saving                                                               
device. A transfer on death is subject to estate taxes.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI asked  if the  main advantage  is to  avoid                                                               
probate.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG said yes.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR DYSON questioned  the provision in paragraph  (4) on page                                                               
5, lines 6-7.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE  GRUENBERG  explained  that the  transfer  doesn't                                                               
occur until the transferor's death.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  WIELECHOWSKI  asked  if   the  contents  of  a  property                                                               
transfer along with the property.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG replied only  something like a shed that                                                               
is affixed to the land would transfer with the property.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR WIELECHOWSKI asked Mr. Orzeske  if there were inheritance                                                               
tax implications.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
10:02:12 AM                                                                                                                   
BEN ORZESKE,  Uniform Law  Commissioner, Chicago,  Illinois, said                                                               
the  bill  removes  the  property from  the  probate  estate  for                                                               
administrative  purposes,  but  would  not  remove  it  from  the                                                               
taxable estate under federal law.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
REPRESENTATIVE GRUENBERG added that it  would be subject to death                                                               
tax.                                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
MR. ORZESKE agreed  that the bill doesn't affect  whatever tax it                                                               
would be if the property were transferred any other way.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
SENATOR  MCGUIRE requested  a list  of the  states that  have TOD                                                               
deeds.                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Unidentified  speaker   said  the  packets  should   contain  Mr.                                                               
Orzeske's written testimony that  has an attachment showing those                                                               
states.                                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
MR.  ORZESKE  reported that  since  he  submitted his  testimony,                                                               
Washington  state  and  West Virginia  enacted  the  Uniform  Act                                                               
bringing the total to 23.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
10:04:54 AM                                                                                                                   
SENATOR  MCGUIRE  moved  to  report HB  60  from  committee  with                                                               
individual recommendations and attached fiscal note(s).                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
CHAIR COGHILL announced that without  objection, CSHB 60(JUD) was                                                               
reported from the Senate Judiciary Standing Committee.